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I recieved a couple of timers from a friend. One was a tick off the other a Tatone flood off. Anybody have instructions copy of this timer? I have a TD .09 that has a fitting above the needle valve that looks like it was used for flood off. I have not ever used one of these. Thanks,Dan
Hi Dan
I don’t recall instructions coming with Tatone timers (it was assumed you knew what you were doing?), however flood off will only work with a pressurized fuel feed.If using a hard tank, pressure is tapped off the engine (via the backplate preferrably) and 2 outlets used; fuel tubing to the NVA assy and a separate fuel tube is routed from the other outlet under the wire lever of the Tatone timer then up to the pipe or fitting taped into the venturi.
If using a bladder you will need a Tee fitting in the fuel line and a separate tube is run from the Tee fitting via the timer as above, to the venturi.
Hope this answers you question. 😀
Dankar,
Floodoff is good for classes where you require a clean, instant engine stop – such as FAI – though it’s been used for years I’ve never liked the thought of flooding an engine with fuel to swamp the plug; to hydraulic any engine running at speed contravenes my idea of taking care of it! Not that I can recall of any problems being so experienced but . . I just don’t like the idea!
For general use (AMA classes) you’re better off to avoid all the associated plumbing and just use the Pinchoff timer in conjunction with a pacifier or bladder .. even suction feed. AMA rules discount the rundown time as the engine stops; ‘last power stroke’ is the guideline, so any last ‘burble’ doesn’t count as engine run.
Thanks all for help. I don’t like the idea of flooding engine to stop it anyway. I have the timer. but will not use it. Cheers,Dan
If I remember right, the Tatone flood-off used a disk(same disk as the DT timer) and a wire trap that held the flood-off line closed. The wire could be replaced with a wire bail/hook and used with a remote shut-off like those avail through Texas Timer.
I used the Tatone flood-off in the late 50’s (others, too) to cure a problem caused by using crankcase pressure. The typical setup was a pressure nipple tapped into the engine backplate. When you shut the fuel off at the needle, some engines would continue to suck fuel back through the pressure tap giving a ragged cut-off or over run. The flood-off was immediate and easy to do. It also stopped pumping when the engine quit, unlike todays bladder systems that dumps raw fuel all over the front of your plane!
– Norm
Okay—howl me down, but l like flood off.
Pinch off perfect for general flying, but l have used flood off for years and years with comp. type models, and have not had a disaster with Rossi’s, Super Tigre’s, Cox 049, 051 or 09.
Built a Mini Weaver 3 or 4 years ago for F1J and built a bladder into it to save the weight of a hard tank—-what a nightmare, what a messy way to do it
semi trimmed the model, took it home and made a hard tank from brass, 3 brass tubes in it– one out of right side to the carb, one out the left side to venturi (silicone tubing under Seelig Mini timer arm) and one out the front to back plate
if you can’t get a back plate, drill a hole through the mounting lug and Cyno tube in—-works a treat on my Cox 09 in a Creep.Good clean cut off, every time, easy to use and no mess. Trust me, do it.
>Good clean cut off, every time,
Howard, your rules probably require timing to silence – hence floodoff is an advantage.
In N.America, timing is to the last audible power stroke, rundown is not counted … though I find a pacifier on pinchoff has very little of such.
Yes Jim, been there, done that with pen bladders and pinch off in early ’70s on 1/2 A models, and filling them, holding them
no no no, so much easier with a hard tank.Yes and no on the run down,perhaps depends on the timer, if you ask me—-can be cruel or kind. Have had it both ways, as most of us probably have lucky one day or the next flight
grrrrrrrrr, grrrrrrrrrrrr.Danka, don’t use the fitting on the 09, waste of time—-disasemble the engine and drill about 1/16th hole in a lug for 1/16th alum. tube, clean up the inside of ANY trash, Cyno the tube into the lug leaving about 3/8th inch out, the silicone tube then to top front of the hard tank, feed tube goes about 3/4 the way to the rear, then flood off to bottom rear corner—-this way engine will flood off even if it’s low on fuel.
lf the engine seems a bit ‘touchy’ squeeze the pressure alum tube, as this ‘hole’ needs to be quite small.
You can also open up your venturi for more grunt too, if you wish when on pressure.
l fill the tank via the feed line and you can get the feel or hear when it’s full. Otherwise easy to fill the crankcase with raw fuel—-if this happens, tip it out and blow in the exhaust to clear it.
> pen bladders and pinch off in early ’70s on 1/2 A models, and filling them, holding them
no no no, so much easier with a hard tank.Now I don’t find it any problem at all to fill a pacifier through the line, close timer, pinch line with a finger, open timer, prime, flick, start, release line ..etc. Sounds a lot but it’s fast and easy. Even more so with an electric starter.
I mount the pacifier on a small clip on the short wire landing skid (never put a neat loop on the end of it, it can hook up a battery lead as you remove ’em and drag down the nose so that the prop chews up the hand holding the airplane; I have the large scar to confirm it…), it’s lighter than a hard tank .. no soldering to do (I HATE soldering!) and if it springs a leak it’s replaceable in seconds ….
If you’ll all pardon an aside ….back in the ’70s I might have been the only one using penbladders in Open or 1/2A power in England … to the extent that another modeller came up to me at a Nationals and said “Hi, I knew you were here when I drove onto the field and saw this big pylon model gliding overhead with a condom dangling under it….”
Filling and handling bladders just got easier with a little on-line clamp sold by Hank Nystrom/Texas Timers.
You can fill the tank, snap the clamp and get ready to fly.
Plug the nose in the starter, turn on the plug current, push the little button release to open the clamp hit the starter, and you are cooking!
Simplicity itself. 😀
Go the the Texas Timers website, the URL for which is elsewhere on this NFFS website.
Flood off is the ONLY way to go….I know many will not like the “complexity”, but much steadier runs, more positive stop, and if you are afraid of loading the engine, place a Tee in the flood-off line with a .032″ dia hole (or so) and dump away. I have never had a problem with rods or crtanks on any of the motors that we have run on flood off. Would not do a Holland Hornet or such, but anything modern (post 1970) will do just fine. Too many good things to give up.
Same with hard tanks. Pacifiers, bladders, or surgical is the only way to go…
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