SEN 2275

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  1. Woa
  2. Increased Round times
  3. Small filed flying
  4. So how long is long


From: Gene Ulm

Herr Schwendemann’s post settled the performance as a cause of decreased participation debate: a whopping 62 f1a participants in the ’16 German Nats proves there isn’t one.  Even deducting the 14 simple models puts the number of “full spec” competitors at 48… from a country with a population about 30% of the size of America.

It seems our declining participation is peculiar to what we do and how we do it in the USA?  We might want to investigate and see what’s worth copying.


Editor’s comment – Some of the level of participation might be due to the travel time. Traveling to the USA Nats from some parts of the country is a major expedition, a multi-day drive or airplane flight with a possible change while the trip would be much shorter in Germany.  Bernhardt or George Batiuk might like to comment.  There is also the FAI “Europe Effect” where because there are many countries close together it is easy , well easier that driving from Los Angeles to Toronto, to go to more World Cup events in another country than it is in the USA.  We have partly compensated for that with the America’s Cup but that is not quite the same level as the World Cup.

Increase Round Times
I am surprised that no one has suggested graduated flight times… 30 sec or so… e.g.
Round 1- 180 sec,
Rnd 2- 210,
Rnd 3- 240s,
Rnd 4- 270s,
Rnd 5- 300s…

then continue for a flyoff if necessary.

Rick Pangell

Editor’s Comment.  Thise was more or less suggested by Chuck Markos who proposed increasing the MAX in general.
The rules permit the CD increasing the round times, even as the round it about to begin.  There is sometimes difficulty in communication it to all particpants.  Also there is a mixed opinion on how effective it is to have a longer round during the thermal part of the day.  Increasing the MAX time can knock out some sportsmen, the question is how many. For example in the F1A event of the Kiwi Cup 2017 we increased it from 180 to 240. This eliminated 10 % of those clean (3 out of 30)

Small field flying

Got the urge to fly but only small fields to do it on? Try SAM designs (Old Timer designs before 1951 and Antique designs before 1939). Most SAM designs had wing loading of 8 oz/sq ft about matching today’s FAI rules. They don’t glide like today’s FAI models because all-balsa constructions didn’t support high aspect ratio wings but they didn’t go far and they are great fun for small field settings. Holds your interest until the next trip to a FAI contest.

So how long is long …
Longest Kiwi Cup Fly Off Flights

Looking back at the Kiwi Cup results since 2015. The following tables show what percentage of the field got in the fly off, how many fly offs were flown and the time of the longest fly off for each of F1ABC.

The table does not show  the weather.  For example this for the Kiwi cup the calm weather helped the increased number of F1Bs make the fly off , the super calm weather did not help the LDA F1As launch higher.  This year  the  4 second engine run cut the F1C performance

YearF1A Contestant F1A in Flyoff    %    F1A # Flyoff F1A Longest Flyoff
2012           54        27    50.00          2            420
2013           43        21    48.84          2            540
2014           56        24    42.86          1            421
2015           52        29    55.77          1            452
2016           57        30    52.63          2            501
2017           56        31    55.36          2            507
F1B Contestant F1B in Flyoff    %    F1B # Flyoff F1B Longest Flyoff
2012           49        21    42.86          3            420
2013           41        17    41.46          2            457
2014           47        21    44.68          1            438
2015           42        27    64.29          1            417
2016           48        30    62.50          2            441
2017           47        31    65.96          2            470
F1C Contestant F1C in Flyoff    %    F1C # Flyoff F1C Longest Flyoff
2012           20         5    25.00          2            420
2013           13         6    46.15          1            345
2014           14         9    64.29          1            600
2015            7         3    42.86          1            600
2016           15         9    60.00          2            440
2017           16         7    43.75          1            453

So not being a statistician I’m not sure what it all means … probably not enough data

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Roger Morrell