SEN 3288
- Elephant from the corner in the Can eating the Worms*
- Proud Luditte
- For Sale Pyxis GPS
- Looking for RDT Arm Band
- Rubber and More at Fab Feb
- 40 grams Pirelli Rubber versus 23 grams Tan Super Sport Rubber –
Elephant from the corner in the Can eating the Worms
In the last SEN we needed to get the issue out because of the Fab Feb Information and there was not enough for the elephant to finish the worm without … well rather finish writing everything.
Some of us work very hard to get the best performance out of our competition aircraft and ourselves on competition day. We expect the that the competitions to run honestly following the rules. We also expect the rules to be such that they enable the organizers to run then properly.
Most of the discussion around the use of onboard flight recorders helping with timing is about people not being awarded flight times that they earned. While it is true it is more likely to be awarded less time earned because the longer the model is in the air , the further away, the smaller it is and the harder to see and time fully to given them full credit. However, the elephant in corner, which for the non-native English spear is common expression to say the slightly uncomfortable fact that no one talks about. But a surprising number of people are awarded more time than they earned. The most common reason is the timing of the wrong model. If you are told you won the contest , you are not so likely not so likely to contest it. But just as you expect to get all the time you earned you have an similar expectation that the other guys won’t be given any extra they did not earn. A notable case to the contrary at the last Feb where 1995 World F1B Champ Jerry Fitch was told he won the F1B fly off, but it was obvious to him from when he flew in the round relative to other flyers that he must have been beaten. Jerry had just installed a new certified altimeter so when he got his model back, he went to the CD and fixed the situation. Very sportsman like. There was another important F1B event where one contestant got a much better time than anyone else and this was not supported by when people flew or what direction but that was the time from the official timekeeper. But when the contest director asked the flyer if he could see the altimeter information, he was told the altimeter did not work properly on that flight.
For the contest organizer who wants to provide official timekeepers is a major challenge to provide competent official timekeepers. For major events like world champs, it is usually possible to make supreme effort and find people, but there are countries who potentially would like to host a World Champs but don’t because they know they could not find the almost 200 capable time keepers needed.
So, to be fair to everyone, if we have some easy, clever very accurate way of recording flight times to be fair to everyone we have to use it to record the bad flight times as well as the good ones ! We want to do it in way that is easy for organizer. Last Feb as part of Fab Feb we did an About Time test in this area. What we did was work with Flying Neurons to a test to see how accurate and easy it would be to do something like this. We (the Fab Feb organizers) put our money where our mouth was and gave the Flying Neurons some money to fund some additional features. What the Neurons did was add a feature their App that let the flyer , once the flight was finished , push a button on the App that sent the information about the flight which included the flight time, the date and time of day of the flight, FAI Id of the flyer and GPS Coordinates of the start and end of the flight all to a Flying Neuron Server that is publicly accessible on the internet. In addition, the Neurons gave the information on how to do that to All-Tee, the other maker of a certified altimeter / on board flight recorder, who added it to their similar App. The All-Tee does not do GPS data so they could not supply that information. This worked very well and it is available now. But surprisingly few people do this during World Cup contests. Maybe the sporting code should require that if you which to contest the timekeepers time in a flight you must record all you flight in the contest in that publicly available server, so people can be comfortable the altimeter is working properly. !? Doing this would make it easier for contest director so we would not me making the application of this technology harder for the contest director. While some further development is needed we are not very far away from where all the flights can be recorded automatically. Provision needs to made to have a way of indicating that a person has indeed entered the event and to record incidents such mid-air collisions, parts falling off models and other infractions. Losing a contest because the other guy won by a timekeeper screw up is a big disincentive to the serious flyer.
Proud Luditte
From: Pierre Chaussebourg
Answer to Walt Ghio
Yes I am quite proud to be a member of the Ludites and I try to imagine what Bob White would have said about all these electronic devices!
I am not against electronic gadgets, I just want to be clear with the rules!
We have very detailed instructions about timing a model from the start to the landing even what happens as soon as the Model gets out of sight!
So I don’t accept electronic (altimeter)timing as far as we still have the old timing rule .
The altimeter timing is still counting seconds when the model is out of sight which is in contradiction with the basic timing rule.
End of the story !
For Sale Pyxis GPS
From:Terry Bond
PYXIS GPS model tracker for sale.
Includes handheld receiver with soft case, two Pyxis beacons, two
batteries, charger and a safe removal tool. This GPS is new and
unused and has never been fitted to a model.
$AU 650 or $US equivalent on the day. Can be available at Feb or posted.
Contact: Terry Bond, Mob: +61 417 027 579. Or email terrybondf1c@gmail.com
Regards 007
Looking for RDT Arm Band
From: Mike Roberts
Might any flyers please suggest a good arm band that holds an Aries RDT transmitter. Mine is quite tattered these days.
Thank You
Mike Roberts
Reply to SEN
Rubber and More at Fab Feb
“FAI Model Supply will be providing rubber and supplies to all those who pre-order for delivery at the FAB February Contests in Lost Hills, CA.
If you are interested in ordering items, we ask that you please send us an email to sales@faimodelsupply.com. Please do not order off our website to have it delivered to the field. Please only order if you are positive you will attend. If you order and do not pick up, we will charge you the cost of shipping the item back to our office.
We will confirm back to you with an invoice indicating your total cost from the group shipment to be collected at Lost Hills or prepaid arrangements available prior to the contest via PayPal. Our plans are to distribute at the contest registration on Friday February 7.
We will need to receive your order by January 27 to guarantee delivery in Lost Hills. Any order/request received after that date can not be guaranteed to be delivered at the contest.
We currently have a batch of 1/8 and 1/16 from our October batch and will be expecting a new batch at the end of January in time for shipping to the February competitions..
Thank you,
Charlie & Geralyn Jones
FAI Model Supply Inc.
—
Regards
Charlie and Geralyn Jones
FAI Model Supply Inc.
40 grams Pirelli Rubber versus 23 grams Tan Super Sport Rubber – Back
to the good old days?
From: Ismet Yurtseven
40 grams Pirelli Rubber versus 23 grams Tan Super Sport Rubber – Back
to the good old days?
There were two dream contests: 1984 F1 ECh at Livno and 1985 F1 WCh at
Livno. In these contests, field, weather and organization were
excellent.
In 1984, I highly impressed from F1B models of Soviet team. Models of
Andriukov, Gorban, Gulugonov and Roshonov were amazing. They were
climbing, climbing and climbing.
That time rubber weight was 40 grams, model weight was 190 grams, all
rounds were 3 minutes max (7 rounds), working time in fly-off was 15
minutes, fly-off max time was starting from 4 minutes and increasing 1
minute in each additional fly-off round.
I was flying an F1B inspired from Samokish with VIT and A/R. Model was
climbing about 80 meters (I was comparing with 50 meters F1A line) and
in early morning time model can fly about 200 seconds. I lost the
model during the training day (D/T failure). I think Soviet models
were climbing more than 100 meters in calm air. Andriukov was flying
his famous short wing balsa model reinforced with some carbon stripes.
During F1C day, he explained me the details of his model (DPR and
other features and trimming). Roshonov gave me a VP front-end, Per
Grunnet gave me his circular tow hook.
So, the models of Soviet team were not worse than today. I think, the
legend of Andriukov and Gorban began with this competition.
In 1985, all legends were at Livno (Hofsass, Doring, Gulugonov, Bob
White, Andriukov, Gorban, Anselmo Zeri, and all other legendary F1B
modelers.) There were 86 competitors from 31 countries. After
excellent fly-off rounds, Rainer Hofsass was the great winner. In the
third fly-off round, Andriukov blew the rubber three times and throw
his winder to the ground. Following is the top results from this
contest.
1 R Hofsass BRD 1260 + 240 + 300 + 360 + 420 + 480
2 L Doring W/C 1260 + 240 + 300 + 360 + 420 + 409
3 Chang Young PRK 1260 + 240 + 300 + 360 + 420 + 294
4 Zhang Wenyi CHN 1260 + 240 + 300 + 360 + 420 + 240
5 Y Gulugonov USSR 1260 + 240 + 300 + 360 + 364
6 A Armesto ARG 1260 + 240 + 300 + 360 + 354
7 R White USA 1260 + 240 + 300 + 360 + 352
8 P Fauser AUS 1260 + 240 + 300 + 360 + 280
9 P Lepage FRA 1260 + 240 + 300 + 360 + 192
10 Oh Ik PRK 1260 + 240 + 300 + 123
11 A Andrjukov USSR 1260 + 240 + 300
11 C M Cabarco CUB 1260 + 240 + 300
13 J Hacken NED 1260 + 240 + 286
14 E Gorban USSR 1260 + 240 + 284
15 A Zeri NED 1260 + 240 + 272
So, my conclusion: I don’t have scientific tools and data to compare
Pirelli and Tan Super Sport rubber, but, on the other hand, my
experience says that performance shown in 1985 F1 WCh is not possible
with ordinary 23 grams Tan Super Sport rubber. Maybe, it is possible
to say, 40 grams Pirelli rubber was producing similar energy as todays
30 grams Tan Super Sport rubber.
With my respects,
Ismet Yurtseven
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…………..
Roger Morrell